[TheDvlsAdvc8]

Instagram brings Instagram to the table. That's it. There's no question that there are photo filtering apps and social networking apps which might be better than what Instagram offers, but people want Instagram.

Why do some people insist on buying Ford Mustangs when there are other sports cars that do the same things... and, in fact, are more slick than the Ford Mustang? Because it's an effing Ford Mustang and lots of people just plain old like Ford Mustangs.

It's not a faux argument at all. It's the truth. You can show an Instagram fan Lomogram's better filters and Flickr's better sharing and whatever other apps you want to show them, but in the end they're just going to want Instagram. Like it or not, bro, that's just the reality of the situation.

No, a Mustang is comparing apples an oranges. Another manufacturer cannot legally build something identical to the Mustang - one of its characteristic features is its appearance. I can go and create the exact same imaging that instagram provides totally legally.

Instagram has nothing more than name recognition for a set a features people want. Show them an equal or better alternative and no one cares. I've done it.

[iamtim]

Go into facebook's iphone app, go online in chat, and click on someone's name. You'll see all your previous conversations with that person, regardless of the platform. Now try that in Windows phone's messaging app. Nope, it won't show for example messages you've sent from other device.

Well, come on dude, you nailed the reason in your own statement: you're looking at the FACEBOOK app, versus the WP MESSAGING app. The former is all about Facebook, whereas the latter is all about messaging on a Windows Phone. You shouldn't expect messages which didn't occur in the Windows Phone Messaging app to show up in the Windows Phone Messaging app.

One could say, "OMG, but it does in email!", to which I would reply that in the Email app you're syncing with an email server. You're not doing that in the Messaging app. While one could then say, "but it's got FB integration!" I would counter with "integration does not equal syncing. Syncing keeps two objects synchronized, integration allows one object to use the other."

Just my $.02.

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

Yeah, and so did Facebook users when Facebook pulled this. And so did Google users when Google pulled this.

Get over it, bro... you may not like Instagram and you may think it's dumb and pointless and you may have found one hundred other apps which do Instagram's job better than Instagram, but to the Instagram loyalist it just plain doesn't matter. And if we want those users on WP, we need Instagram. Period.

We'll see. I shared the above link on fb when I found it. I already have a 15+ comment conversation that I'm not even a part of going on about what alternative apps are out there. Facebook and google are difficult to replace. Instagram? lol EASY.

I doubt they keep the policy, but if they do they're going to lose a lot of users.

[iamtim]

No, a Mustang is comparing apples an oranges.

Not when you're talking about brand loyalty, which is the issue here.

So near as I can figure it, you either don't understand brand loyalty or you're a troll. Either way, I can't help you understand why Instagram is important. So continue your crusade against it and watch the Instagram fans NOT get Windows Phones. Me, I'm going to push for any app which helps bring people to Windows Phone. I can look beyond my own preferences and see the value in something that others like.

[ticktock5]

Well, come on dude, you nailed the reason in your own statement: you're looking at the FACEBOOK app, versus the WP MESSAGING app. The former is all about Facebook, whereas the latter is all about messaging on a Windows Phone. You shouldn't expect messages which didn't occur in the Windows Phone Messaging app to show up in the Windows Phone Messaging app.One could say, "OMG, but it does in email!", to which I would reply that in the Email app you're syncing with an email server. You're not doing that in the Messaging app. While one could then say, "but it's got FB integration!" I would counter with "integration does not equal syncing. Syncing keeps two objects synchronized, integration allows one object to use the other."Just my $.02.

I've explained this several times, I think you're choosing not to understand at this point. I'm comparing the wp messaging app to the iPhone Facebook app, because wp's Facebook app does not have chat. I'd be ok with how crappy the wp messaging is IF I had a dedicated facebook app that could do it. But there isn't. How hard is that to understand?

[stmav]

15 yard penalty for excessive use of bro in an arguement.

[ticktock5]

Yea all I didn't mean for the thread to derail like this. I appreciate the answers so far. Basically what I've gathered:

Instagram - may come as lumia exclusive at first but in the works?

Facebook - ? Whether we'll ever get a real app

Google - being awful, don't expect much

[iamtim]

I'm comparing the wp messaging app to the iPhone Facebook app, because wp's Facebook app does not have chat.

...and what I'm saying is you can't compare the two, because they're not the same. As I said, the first is a phone-based messaging app, the second is a Facebook-based full-featured app. You'd be better off saying that what you're looking for in the Facebook app doesn't exist on Windows Phone, however, Windows Phone does allow you to engage in device-based Facebook chats.

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

No, you still don't get it. There is a difference between messaging and chat. If you have all these devices, try it yourself. Go into facebook's iphone app, go online in chat, and click on someone's name. You'll see all your previous conversations with that person, regardless of the platform. Now try that in Windows phone's messaging app. Nope, it won't show for example messages you've sent from other device. Your workaround allows you to view the messages, yes, but not go online and chat in real time. If facebook had an app that worked the same as it does on iphone and android, this would not be a problem. But they have chosen not to, and WP users are suffering (not just because of this issue, but the entire app... if you really think the WP facebook app can do everything the official facebook apps on the other phones can do... you must not use facebook much).

You do come across as a fanboy because you're making excuses for WP lacking basic functionality. Like how exactly do the same thing as instagram on your WP? How do you upload photos to your stream, like photos, follow people, have followers, etc. If you say "i have a filter app and then post the pictures to facebook" you're massively missing the point of it being a social network.

I have an iphone, android phone and windows phone... I am a developer. I know what the behavior of the facebook app everywhere is. What you've described is identical to the behavior of the facebook app messaging in windows phone. I just sent and received messages from my wife via the wp facebook app just now. Is it polished? No... its not really a "chat". The messaging hub doesn't have the conversations you've had everywhere else? Okay, woe is you.

You're right, instagram is its own social network... so is flickr... so is facebook... and a million others. Nothing about instagram creates a unique experience and the overwhelming share of instagram users share to facebook also. I do have an account and I have friends who use it. A make or break app for the VAST majority of people it is not.

I don't have to make excuses, there is no lack of basic functionality in WP even without instagram. Just like in "bro's" auto example, my Porsche isn't lacking horsepower because it isn't a Mustang. Now, if you want a Ford over a Porsche, or an Instagram over a Flickr, or your brand of choice... so be it, but its not for a lack of fully functional options and alternatives.

I don't criticize my iphone because none of my app icons show me any information.... what lack of basic functionality!! See, I'm not the guy who wanted an iphone and bought a windows phone. I know its strengths and weaknesses. Go get an iphone and stop wasting time here complaining.

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

Not when you're talking about brand loyalty, which is the issue here.

So near as I can figure it, you either don't understand brand loyalty or you're a troll. Either way, I can't help you understand why Instagram is important. So continue your crusade against it and watch the Instagram fans NOT get Windows Phones. Me, I'm going to push for any app which helps bring people to Windows Phone. I can look beyond my own preferences and see the value in something that others like.

Ah, now I get it. Brand loyal folks are going to switch from their iphones and androids because windows phone gets instagram? lmfao. Good luck.

[iamtim]

Ah, now I get it. Brand loyal folks are going to switch from their iphones and androids because windows phone gets instagram?

No, evidently you don't get it.

Instagram loyalists aren't going to give Windows Phone a second glance if it doesn't have Instagram. But everyone upgrades their phone now and again and if Microsoft does their job and gets some iPhone/Android users considering a switch to Windows Phone, they may choose Windows Phone if their "pet" app is available for it.

I don't know why you're so opposed to this relatively simple concept. Having Instagram won't hurt you, but it might help Windows Phone succeed. Why the resistance?

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

No, evidently you don't get it.

Instagram loyalists aren't going to give Windows Phone a second glance if it doesn't have Instagram. But everyone upgrades their phone now and again and if Microsoft does their job and gets some iPhone/Android users considering a switch to Windows Phone, they may choose Windows Phone if their "pet" app is available for it.

I don't know why you're so opposed to this relatively simple concept. Having Instagram won't hurt you, but it might help Windows Phone succeed. Why the resistance?

I don't have any resistance to it. I have objection to the lack of it being labeled "missing basic functionality". Its clearly not. I simply don't agree with you that instagram brand loyalty exceeds apple or google loyalty. I expect people who are stuck on brand, are likely even more stuck on larger brands. In this context, instagram and similarly irrelevant.

[ticktock5]

No, evidently you don't get it. Instagram loyalists aren't going to give Windows Phone a second glance if it doesn't have Instagram. But everyone upgrades their phone now and again and if Microsoft does their job and gets some iPhone/Android users considering a switch to Windows Phone, they may choose Windows Phone if their "pet" app is available for it.I don't know why you're so opposed to this relatively simple concept. Having Instagram won't hurt you, but it might help Windows Phone succeed. Why the resistance?

Because they're fanboys. They can't imagine their precious WP as being anything less than perfect. "But WP can't do X"? "X is dumb, why would you need that, stop being such a sheep, etc." There's no point even trying to reason. I think (hope) the people actually behind the OS are more reasonable (because they actually have to worry about making money).Sorry I even bothered... Maybe I'll try hofo

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

Because they're fanboys. They can't imagine their precious WP as being anything less than perfect. "But WP can't do X"? "X is dumb, why would you need that, stop being such a sheep, etc." There's no point even trying to reason. I think (hope) the people actually behind the OS are more reasonable (because they actually have to worry about making money).Sorry I even bothered... Maybe I'll try hofo

What did you hope to accomplish? That we here at wpcentral forums would magically make your messaging hub show your precious facebook message history from the website? Really?

You came to complain, simple as that.

I don't have anything against instagram... I don't really care about it at all because there are alternatives to it. Keep your brand loyalty and go back to whatever platform you were so happy with that you left it for a windows phone that "lacks basic functionality".

[iamtim]

I have objection to the lack of it being labeled "missing basic functionality".

I agree with you there, Instagram is not basic functionality. Nor is WhatsApp or any of the other popular apps which don't appear in the WP Marketplace. However, what I replied to was this: "Why on gods earth is instagram so popular? ... so as to make it a deal breaker?" That's what I've been on about.

So yeah... basic functionality it's not. Popular and a deal-breaker it is.

[TheDvlsAdvc8]

a deal-breaker it is.

I disagree. I have doubts there is anyone out there who is going "oooo... when windows phone gets instagram, I'm getting one!!" If you have a brand loyalty to it, you likely have an even greater brand loyalty to the bigger brands... apple and google.

[ticktock5]

What did you hope to accomplish? That we here at wpcentral forums would magically make your messaging hub show your precious facebook message history from the website? Really?You came to complain, simple as that.

Um, no, I came to ask whether or not Facebook was planning to develop its own app for WP, and got jumped on for not being satisfied with messaging as it is.

[jdom]

i still don't understand why some apps are so important that people rather return a phone they love than live with it.
Amazing!!!

[iamtim]

I have doubts there is anyone out there who is going "oooo... when windows phone gets instagram, I'm getting one!!"

Please re-read the second paragraph of this post.

EDIT: And, on top of that, if there never is an Instagram app, we'll never know if there is anyone out there saying that.

[tk-093]

Brand loyality? Not even close. Brand loyality is like me only driving Fords. Even though I only drive Fords, guess what, I can still pick up my friends and we can hang out, even if they own Chevys. However, if 5 of my friends use Hipstergram and I move to Windows Phone, we can't "hang out." It would totally be a deal breaker for some people and I wouldn't blame them no matter how silly we think Hipstergram is.

Hard core fanboys are not going to switch to WP just because it gets Hipstergram, but there are tons and tons of people that are not fanboys (a higher percentage on Android then iOS) and they may choose another platform if they don't have what they want. At such a small marketshare right now, we can use everybody we can get. I've been messing with my GS3 today to test out Google Now and I'm already sick of it again, I wish I wouldn't have left my 822 at home... :(

[12Danny123]

Yea. people these days.

[tk-093]

i still don't understand why some apps are so important that people rather return a phone they love than live with it.
Amazing!!!

I'm with you, but there is a large group out there that are obsessed with taking pictures of random things, and posting it hoping they get random people they will never meet to comment on it. :) Or at least that's how I think it works.. I don't use it.

[iamtim]

there are tons and tons of people that are not fanboys (a higher percentage on Android then iOS) and they may choose another platform if they don't have what they want. At such a small marketshare right now, we can use everybody we can get.

Uhm... *blink, blink*... yeah, that's the point I was trying to make. Did I say something insinuating otherwise?

[tk-093]

Uhm... *blink, blink*... yeah, that's the point I was trying to make. Did I say something insinuating otherwise?

I'm on your side dude, wasn't directing it at you. :)

[iamtim]

I'm on your side dude, wasn't directing it at you. :)

Ah, ok. Phew. :D