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  1. philxor's Avatar
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    #76  
    Apple allows family sharing of apps using the Home Sharing feature of iTunes but it works over local Wifi and when apps get updated it requires the original owner of the app to update and then re-sync the app so it's somewhat of a pain.

    Most families share the same iTunes account so everyone just has the same apps, gets updates, etc.

    There was a lot of fear Apple would make your iCloud account the same as your iTunes account but they didn't, if they had we'd have the same issues people are running into now with WP where so much is tied to a single login.
  2. ironsoulreaver's Avatar
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    #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by philxor View Post
    Apple allows family sharing of apps using the Home Sharing feature of iTunes but it works over local Wifi and when apps get updated it requires the original owner of the app to update and then re-sync the app so it's somewhat of a pain.

    Most families share the same iTunes account so everyone just has the same apps, gets updates, etc.

    There was a lot of fear Apple would make your iCloud account the same as your iTunes account but they didn't, if they had we'd have the same issues people are running into now with WP where so much is tied to a single login.
    home sharing just allows you to sync your idevice on multiple computers. You still need your account information. ITunes works just like on the phone. You login to your account and dl whatever app and then whoever syncs to that computer can install it.

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  3. WPenvy's Avatar
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    #78  
    Support the developers dammit. I've been to events by Microsoft and talked with these folks. What they do is quite challenging, and a pain at times. At least appreciate the fact that they're able to do stuff that you can't even come up with ideas for
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  4. willied's Avatar
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    #79  
    All I have to say is no one is stealing from a developer by account sharing if they aren't going to pay for it in the first place.
  5. tgp
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    #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by WPenvy View Post
    Support the developers dammit. I've been to events by Microsoft and talked with these folks. What they do is quite challenging, and a pain at times. At least appreciate the fact that they're able to do stuff that you can't even come up with ideas for
    I agree with this, but yet I have to wonder why we aren't having the same conversation about iOS & Android developers. iOS & Android seem to have much more liberal sharing policies; if that's the problem, they should be the "unsupported" developers, not WP's.
  6.    #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by tlgraber View Post
    I agree with this, but yet I have to wonder why we aren't having the same conversation about iOS & Android developers. iOS & Android seem to have much more liberal sharing policies; if that's the problem, they should be the "unsupported" developers, not WP's.
    exactly, but those developers probably understand the simple concept the more customers the more sales
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  7. kwajr's Avatar
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    #82  
    This is another reason we need an Xbox total family pass me and my fam could each have an Xbox music pass and live have our own collections then if we wanted apps we would buy them on each device but now if you don't want to pay for 2 live accounts 2 music passes etc you have to use the main login on each phone then setup email separately. I will gladly pay say 180 year for a true Xbox pass throw another 80 in there for a video pass.
    Remember Zune you could have a total of 5 devices registered on the account and remove 1 per 30 days and that was legally how many had 5 for each person I had 5 but it was each persons
  8. philxor's Avatar
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    #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by tlgraber View Post
    I agree with this, but yet I have to wonder why we aren't having the same conversation about iOS & Android developers. iOS & Android seem to have much more liberal sharing policies; if that's the problem, they should be the "unsupported" developers, not WP's.
    iOS has the same sharing policy as WP does, 5 devices. The difference is in iOS the app purchasing account can be separated from everything else, whereas in WP it's not and if you want to change it you have to hard reset the phone to defaults. Microsoft wants everything from MS you use to be tied to one account which is your main login. I see the benefit in it keeps people from having to manage a bunch of separate accounts for each service but can create headaches as well.

    Android actually lets you store multiple accounts on the phone for use with Google Play making it even easier than iOS.
  9. AsphyxiA's Avatar
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    #84  
    how about this. if you have 3 family member, A, B, & C, & you only got 1 phone. definitely, when A using the phone, B & C can't use it, same goes when B or C use the phone.
    same principle goes to the app sharing, sure you can share the app to your other family member on different phone, but when it comes to using it, only one app can be open at one time. say, A open the app, a seconds later B also open the app, but B got a notification like "app is being used by other member, please try again after the app being closed by the other member" or something like that.
    it's a bit complicated, but it erase the "stealing" analogy though & can't be shared when the apps require background task or automatically disabled the background task feature when apps are being shared..
    it's an immature concept, sorry -____-
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  10. ironsoulreaver's Avatar
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    #85  
    It's not complicated but god would that be annoying. The easiest way is to change the TOS for developers and add the ability to sign into another account and download purchases. Make an authorization list for accounts just like they do with devices to keep casual sharing at a minimum.

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  11. futurix's Avatar
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    #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by willied View Post
    All I have to say is no one is stealing from a developer by account sharing if they aren't going to pay for it in the first place.
    This is just not true (and not an excuse for stealing).

    Quote Originally Posted by rdubmu View Post
    exactly, but those developers probably understand the simple concept the more customers the more sales
    It does not work when most of the customers are thiefs.
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  12. Rensul's Avatar
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    #87  
    Just like the Apple ecosystem, you have your Microsoft account and the Microsoft Store account. The Microsoft Store account can be set up on your different family devices while they are logged in under their own Microsoft account allowing them access to the apps that have already been purchased.
  13. philxor's Avatar
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    #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rensul View Post
    Just like the Apple ecosystem, you have your Microsoft account and the Microsoft Store account. The Microsoft Store account can be set up on your different family devices while they are logged in under their own Microsoft account allowing them access to the apps that have already been purchased.
    The current way and direction of MS is you have one MS account period. I don't have an option in WP8 for a different store account. If you could do what you mentioned this thread wouldn't exist. :)
  14. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by philxor View Post
    Looking at the actual Terms of Use posted on the Windows Phone Marketplace it simply reads:

    1. INSTALLATION AND USE RIGHTS. You may install and use one copy of the application on up to five (5) Windows Phone enabled devices that are affiliated with the Microsoft account you use to access the Windows Phone Store/Marketplace.

    It doesn't say anything about you being the owner of the device, having it in your control, etc. Hopmedic posted the ToU from Live.com which is completely different than the Windows Phone Marketplace. It states you can't have someone else controlling your account which is standard for pretty much any account-based service in existence. The WP Marketplace ToU are actually less restrictive than the iOS ones, which stipulate you must either own or control the device in order to install an application. To say that iOS has "app sharing" would be wrong, it really doesn't have any more allowances than WP does.

    Keep in mind the ToU for media content on itunes is much more relaxed and they even have home sharing as a feature.

    And what account do you use to access the Windows Phone Store? You got it - your Live.com account. So, what I posted is the pertinent TOS for this discussion.


    Quote Originally Posted by willied View Post
    All I have to say is no one is stealing from a developer by account sharing if they aren't going to pay for it in the first place.
    This is an example of ignorance speaking. The corollary would be no one is stealing from a Mercedes dealership if they aren't going to pay for a Mercedes in the first place.
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  15. #90  
    And to this who say drop the subject for the good of the platform, the platform won't go anywhere if you insist on stealing from the developers. Without devs the platform, like the others, is nothing.
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  16. vincentw56's Avatar
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    #91  
    This is something I have said for a long time about Xbox Live. I have a family live account. It sucks that I had to buy 2 copies of Minecraft. I have 3 consoles that share the family account, but if I want any DLC and it be used between accounts, I have to buy it for multiple accounts. It should be shared between the family account. Same goes for the phones. There is no reason for my wife and I to have to buy the same software for each phone. And, I am a developer and I still believe this.
  17. ironsoulreaver's Avatar
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    #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by vincentw56 View Post
    This is something I have said for a long time about Xbox Live. I have a family live account. It sucks that I had to buy 2 copies of Minecraft. I have 3 consoles that share the family account, but if I want any DLC and it be used between accounts, I have to buy it for multiple accounts. It should be shared between the family account. Same goes for the phones. There is no reason for my wife and I to have to buy the same software for each phone. And, I am a developer and I still believe this.
    I only own 1 XBox, but couldn't you just log into your account on the other two XBox's and download them again?

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  18. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by vincentw56 View Post
    This is something I have said for a long time about Xbox Live. I have a family live account. It sucks that I had to buy 2 copies of Minecraft. I have 3 consoles that share the family account, but if I want any DLC and it be used between accounts, I have to buy it for multiple accounts. It should be shared between the family account. Same goes for the phones. There is no reason for my wife and I to have to buy the same software for each phone. And, I am a developer and I still believe this.
    I don't have an XBox. I'm not familiar with XBox Live, nor how their model works. But if I develop an app for Windows Phone, and two people with Windows Phones want a copy, then I will sell two copies of it, not one. That's how it works. This isn't XBox - This is Windows Phone. It really makes no difference how other devices work, as other devices are not Windows Phones. One person doesn't carry an XBox around with him - that is generally a family devices, attached to a family TV, not an individual device carried around in one's pocket. Big difference in how the devices are used. Let's just talk about Windows Phone, the TOS of Windows Phone and the Live Account associated with it, and the laws regarding copyrighted works and intellectual property.
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  19. Thigis's Avatar
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    #94  
    I'm not familiar with Xbox music, but from what i understand the music industry has pretty much lost the DRM war haven't they? I don't own a single mp3 that is DRM protected.
  20. palandri's Avatar
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    #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thigis View Post
    I'm not familiar with Xbox music, but from what i understand the music industry has pretty much lost the DRM war haven't they? I don't own a single mp3 that is DRM protected.
    It varies from country to country. I take it you're not from the states? The states have the strictest laws protecting the music industry. I had something called XM satellite radio in my truck which I had a subscription too. I dumped it after they added a DRM fee to my bill.
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  21. futurix's Avatar
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    #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thigis View Post
    I'm not familiar with Xbox music, but from what i understand the music industry has pretty much lost the DRM war haven't they? I don't own a single mp3 that is DRM protected.
    And that's why the music industry is in the crapper now.
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  22. tk-093's Avatar
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    #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thigis View Post
    I'm not familiar with Xbox music, but from what i understand the music industry has pretty much lost the DRM war haven't they? I don't own a single mp3 that is DRM protected.
    They lost the DRM war when it comes to actually buying a song. If you paid $.99 for a song, in the old days they would still DRM it. That is gone. There still is DRM on the subscription model.. XBox, Spotify, Pandora, etc. But that is to be expected.
  23. andrelamont's Avatar
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    #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by hopmedic View Post
    I don't have an XBox. I'm not familiar with XBox Live, nor how their model works. But if I develop an app for Windows Phone, and two people with Windows Phones want a copy, then I will sell two copies of it, not one. That's how it works. This isn't XBox - This is Windows Phone. It really makes no difference how other devices work, as other devices are not Windows Phones. One person doesn't carry an XBox around with him - that is generally a family devices, attached to a family TV, not an individual device carried around in one's pocket. Big difference in how the devices are used. Let's just talk about Windows Phone, the TOS of Windows Phone and the Live Account associated with it, and the laws regarding copyrighted works and intellectual property.
    I think its obvious this is the way WP works...no one is debating that. TOS, MS Guidelines, live accounts and blah blah blah.


    Does this policy harm MS in the marketplace or drive more users to their ecosystem, and for some...the answer is yes. This policy is preventing some people from adopting MS phones and tablets. How much..who knows? but with a meager 3% of the smartphone market I am not sure if MS can afford to turn of casual users when the market leader (stage right...APPLE) has no problems with their model and they are crushing MS in this space. How many MS execs have losted jobs b/c they can't get their mobile act together.


    MS policy is hurting potential switchers...in the real world. As stated before, I refused to recommend that my family buy MS phones for this very reason and I am not the only one.( I know I am a hypocrite b/c I have owned 3 WP..but I am not a big app guy so it doesn't impact me...plus I am software engineer by day and I am heavily invested career wise in MS technologies )


    So puff yer chest up talking about terms of services and and watch MS continue to lose sales compared to iOS because of their policies
  24. willied's Avatar
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    #99  
    Quote Originally Posted by hopmedic View Post
    This is an example of ignorance speaking. The corollary would be no one is stealing from a Mercedes dealership if they aren't going to pay for a Mercedes in the first place.
    This is an example of ignorance speaking. Stealing a Mercedes would be taking something away that the dealer actually had. If I shared an app with someone in my family, you lose nothing, you just don't gain anything either.
  25. inteller's Avatar
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    #100  
    the one thing I'd like to see is the distribution of free codes for a Surface version of the app if you bought the WP version. Since iOS has a unified app platform you can buy an iphone app and rn it on your iPad. Since you can't do that on WP8/W8 it would be nice if the developers helped facilitate such a function.\

    Also, on Windows 8 you CAN buy an app once and have multiple users use it. It doesn't work perfectly if the app stores user settings centrally, but it works.
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