Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 48 of 48
Like Tree9Likes
  1. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    2,092 Posts
    Global Posts
    2,578 Global Posts
    #26  
    The marginal cost of the radio hardware and software was likely not worth the marginal benefit from it. If millions of WPs with built-in radios added $1 in cost per phone, but only a few thousand users actually use it, it makes economic sense to eliminate the feature and use the resources on something that would benefit more people.
  2. CSJr1's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    176 Posts
       #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    The marginal cost of the radio hardware and software was likely not worth the marginal benefit from it. If millions of WPs with built-in radios added $1 in cost per phone, but only a few thousand users actually use it, it makes economic sense to eliminate the feature and use the resources on something that would benefit more people.
    I promise I'll let you get the last word, so here is my (hopefully) last response.

    The hardware is already there. There is no extra cost to it. As far as software cost to enable it again for WP8, I would bet $10,000 dollars and a pension fund that the miniscle 2-4 manhours needed to turn back on this feature (most $1,000) would be justified for even low end 1% of the customers that apprecieated it.

    I hope I am wrong or I hope the feature will come back. But I think Microsoft was strong armed by the carriers to leave this feature out. In their risk analysis, they figured that the carriers would advertise the WP8 product more and Microsoft would get more adopters. So if they lose 1% of WP7 adopters but gain 30% more customers to WP8 because of carrier support, it worked out for them and the carriers get to charge data fees for streaming radio.

    I think I understand that I am a minor statistical blimp of corporate greed.
  3. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    2,092 Posts
    Global Posts
    2,578 Global Posts
    #28  
    "The hardware is already there"

    There's an FM crystal in the 8X and 920? Didn't realize that.
  4. CSJr1's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    176 Posts
       #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    "The hardware is already there"

    There's an FM crystal in the 8X and 920? Didn't realize that.
    Ok, ok, ok... Forget what I said last time about you getting the final word... This time I really really mean it;)

    Wasn't sure if you were serious about not being aware.
    https://developer.qualcomm.com/sites...t-overview.pdf
    Its in the specs of page 1 and 2.
  5. pjs37's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    414 Posts
    Global Posts
    415 Global Posts
    #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by ebsn View Post
    Ok, ok, ok... Forget what I said last time about you getting the final word... This time I really really mean it;)

    Wasn't sure if you were serious about not being aware.
    https://developer.qualcomm.com/sites...t-overview.pdf
    Its in the specs of page 1 and 2.
    Technically the support for FM connectivity is there which isn't the same as saying there is a FM tuner already on the chipset thus the fine print note of requiring additional components at the bottom. Even if a chipset support something doesn't mean the OEM will put that additional hardware in there in order to save cost or increase battery life etc.
    brmiller1976 likes this.
  6. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    2,092 Posts
    Global Posts
    2,578 Global Posts
    #31  
    If it is the case that all the hardware is there, I'm sure some intrepid developer could code an app to use it pretty easily.
  7. chevans920's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    189 Posts
    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    If it is the case that all the hardware is there, I'm sure some intrepid developer could code an app to use it pretty easily.
    IF the hardware is there, I agree. Someone will come up with a solution to leverage it. IMHO, that could be nice. It would let me listen to my sports talk stations without using data, while I am at work.
  8. #33  
    I tried using the FM radio on both my arrive and HD7 in the past and couldn't get reception on any stations that were even remotely useful whereas a flashlight radio (with a real antenna) picked up those stations clear.
  9. eyeinthesky's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    11 Posts
    #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by chevans920 View Post
    IF the hardware is there, I agree. Someone will come up with a solution to leverage it. IMHO, that could be nice. It would let me listen to my sports talk stations without using data, while I am at work.
    No one will be able to code for the FM radio. Here is why:

    App platform compatibility

    I am not sure if, hardware permits, Microsoft/OEM can enable it somehow at the later stage, but it seems that a third party app will not be able to enable the radio.

    There goes my plan to buy Nokia Lumia 920. Aaaaarrrrggggggghhhhhhh :mad: :@
  10. CSJr1's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    176 Posts
       #35  
    Unfortunately, you are correct. We don't have access to the OS with unlocked boot loader or anything. If this is going to happen, it has to be something that Microsoft pushes back against the carrier on for the benefit of the consumer.

    Besides we are not only paying for the phone, we are also paying for the Qualcomm SoC.
  11. #36  
    Who cares. I have radio in my car.

    If I happen to be far enough from people or civilization, how would I have gotten that far away without a vehicle. To my recollection, vehicles have had radios in them since the 1920's. If I find myself out where a vehicle would not go, and I long to hear a human voice, I'm sure I can wait until I get back. If I'm far enough away from people on foot that I can't get back, the battery will die in less than 2 days anyways.

    You are whining about a niche feature. Most people only care that they have at least 32gigs of local memory for music and podcasts. Personally, I can't stand the radio. That mainsteam music makes me want to drown infants in a burlap sack. Give me some heavy metal (that no north american radio station plays btw, I can only take so much of AC/DC and Alanis Morosette (sp?)) and I couldn't possibly care less that FM radio is gone.
    willied likes this.
  12. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by ebsn View Post
    Hi brmiller, this is not a good analogy. Now if the phone had a floppy drive and software was used to disable it..., that would be a good analogy. Consider if your manufacturer made a car that had FM/AM radio, but the dealership disabled it because they wanted you to pay for their Satellite radio service. This is a much better anaology.

    As far as streaming.
    1. It cant be done everywhere.
    2. It can't be done without a sim card/(data service)
    3. All stations are not available.
    4. Most carriers charge or throttle data.
    This isn't entirely a correct analogy either. It's more like this:

    A car manufacturer offers several options for audio in a vehicle. They offer standard AM/FM with CD, standard AM FM without CD, HD AM/FM with CD, and In dash navigation with all those features. The CPU/Cmd module of the vehicle supports the in dash naviation console but without the software from the screen module connected to it, it doesn't give you those features. They use the same Cmd module for all those options because it is economical and less costly than installing a Cmd module that has less features.

    So are they removing a feature from you because you didn't get the advanced navigation system simply because the CPU supports it? No.

    The demand for FM radio is likely so small, that they don't see any need to try force all manufacturers to include functionality for it as a standard, even if the snapdragon supports it.
  13. willied's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    707 Posts
    Global Posts
    710 Global Posts
    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by ImmortalWarrior View Post
    You are whining about a niche feature. Most people only care that they have at least 32gigs of local memory for music and podcasts. Personally, I can't stand the radio. That mainsteam music makes me want to drown infants in a burlap sack. Give me some heavy metal (that no north american radio station plays btw, I can only take so much of AC/DC and Alanis Morosette (sp?)) and I couldn't possibly care less that FM radio is gone.
    I have to agree about what's played on the radio. I cannot stand mainstream radio, and never listen to it anymore. Either they play horrible music, or songs that I've heard a 1000 times before. There are a few good stations (102.1 The Edge in Toronto is a pretty good alt rock station), but where I live they suck. I'd rather listen to my awesome music instead of having to listen to crap and ads on top of that. I do like Alanis Morissette, though. ha
  14. Squachy's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    179 Posts
    #39  
    iphone5 apparently has an FM radio transmitter, but IOS 6 doesnt support it.

    Guess iphone is not for you either.....
  15. brmiller1976's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    2,092 Posts
    Global Posts
    2,578 Global Posts
    #40  
    Actually, the idea that carriers don't like FM makes sense. It is a competing channel for advertisers and content, after all.
  16. Jordan Miera's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    22 Posts
    Global Posts
    32 Global Posts
    #41  
    What?! So it's been confirmed that Windows Phones won't have FM radio? What a shame...that was one of the things that drew me to Windows Phone 7 in the first place. Don't really know what I'm going to do. I still love the OS, but one of its perks has been taken away. I have nothing against the other OSes either...I'll have to wait to compare the next generation of phones in person, I suppose.
  17. socialcarpet's Avatar
    Banned

    Posts
    1,893 Posts
    Global Posts
    1,966 Global Posts
    #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by camstreet1 View Post
    It's really weird to see people on here making fun of other people for wanting a feature like FM radio that most other phones (smart or otherwise) have.
    Most phones do NOT have FM radio.

    Another point that everyone seems to be missing here is that FM radio requires HARDWARE.

    The OEM's have decided to opt out of including the HARDWARE used to receive FM radio broadcasts, likely because there is so little demand for it and space is a precious commodity inside a modern smartphone.

    So it's not Microsoft's fault.

    I thought the FM radio was kind of a cool feature, though I rarely used it, the idea of listening without using bandwidth/data is appealing, though all local radio is generally crap, there's always NPR.

    I'd like to have FM radio just for the **** of it, but I can't say I'm really going to miss it all that much. If there was a way to listen to it over the speaker instead of headphones and they supported HD radio broadcasts instead of the old staticky junk, I'd been a little more interested.

    The bottom line is most people don't care about this feature, that's the truth. Sometimes people here get a little caught up in thinking that something that is really important to them is/should be important to everyone. It's just not always the case. Trust me when I tell you 99% of the smartphone market, in the U.S. at least, could not give any less of a **** about FM radio being included.
    Laura Knotek and mlm1950 like this.
  18. #43  
    Last edited by Laura Knotek; 11-04-2012 at 01:43 PM. Reason: added link
  19. mlm1950's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    477 Posts
    #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by socialcarpet View Post
    I'd like to have FM radio just for the **** of it, but I can't say I'm really going to miss it all that much. If there was a way to listen to it over the speaker instead of headphones and they supported HD radio broadcasts instead of the old staticky junk, I'd been a little more interested.
    The fact that you need to plug in headphones, to act as an antenna, kills it for me.
  20. CSJr1's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    176 Posts
       #45  
    I understand I am in the minority. Maybe even a 1 per center. I appreciate all forms of audio consumption, this is not just about music. I have used FM Radio in conditions where it is impossible for internet radio. I can think of another situation where FM would be vital. Like some of you who could care less about FM, my individuality prevents me from following along with what is best for others. But I respect your opinion.

    But what puzzles me is the staunch defense of FM's departure as I thought more would give pause about the loss of choice, the loss of freedom and the loss of functionality.

    But when all is said and done, this is just one voice expressed on an internet forum.
  21. Munkeyphyst's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    84 Posts
    #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by ebsn View Post
    I understand I am in the minority. Maybe even a 1 per center. I appreciate all forms of audio consumption, this is not just about music. I have used FM Radio in conditions where it is impossible for internet radio. I can think of another situation where FM would be vital. Like some of you who could care less about FM, my individuality prevents me from following along with what is best for others. But I respect your opinion.

    But what puzzles me is the staunch defense of FM's departure as I thought more would give pause about the loss of choice, the loss of freedom and the loss of functionality.

    But when all is said and done, this is just one voice expressed on an internet forum.
    the headphone requirement killed the possibility of me using the FM as well. It wasn't something I used, but kinda lame to take away that function when the phone obviously still supports it.
  22. firstness's Avatar
    Member

    Posts
    33 Posts
    Global Posts
    51 Global Posts
    #47  
    I found these statistics on radio listeners which I found interesting:
    Audio: By the Numbers | State of the Media

    It seems radio is still more popular than I thought. Total radio listeners have remained fairly constant but more are switching away from traditional AM/FM broadcasts towards digital streams on their phones/cars/computers.
  23. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by ebsn View Post
    I understand I am in the minority. Maybe even a 1 per center. I appreciate all forms of audio consumption, this is not just about music. I have used FM Radio in conditions where it is impossible for internet radio. I can think of another situation where FM would be vital. Like some of you who could care less about FM, my individuality prevents me from following along with what is best for others. But I respect your opinion.

    But what puzzles me is the staunch defense of FM's departure as I thought more would give pause about the loss of choice, the loss of freedom and the loss of functionality.

    But when all is said and done, this is just one voice expressed on an internet forum.
    I can understand your point. However, in terms of "vital situations", I would rather have AM than FM. The last time I remember hearing anything crucial related to news on FM was on 9/11. Where I live, FM radio plays crummy music. If one wants news, he needs to switch to AM.
    Last edited by Laura Knotek; 11-05-2012 at 09:21 AM.
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

B