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  1. Winterfang's Avatar
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    #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Umm Yeah... View Post
    Actually, there are articles now saying that the low price in the 900 will kill demand in the HTC Titan II. See it here -http://thenextweb.com/mobile/2012/01/25/the-htc-titan-ii-is-dead-on-arrival/ I just don't want the WP devices to be pigeonholed as the down market alternative. Why would anyone pay twice as much for a phone that offers little more than a larger screen and a higher mp camera.
    Mmm I don't know man, the Titan II is better specd than the Lumia in every way.
  2. Duvi's Avatar
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       #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfang View Post
    Mmm I don't know man, the Titan II is better specd than the Lumia in every way.
    Looks for me goes to the 900. And color, with cyan.


    Sent from my iPhone 4S using Tapatalk

    WPCentral Mod | Retired Android Central Mod | CrackBerry Mod
  3. Winterfang's Avatar
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    #28  
    Oh absolutly. I want to buy this game for the look, not for the specs. I can just imagine myself using it and the ladies being all " Oh Winter your phone is so cool, but it looks so lonely, here have my number" And I'll be all like, wait aren't you Shakira? Sweet!.
  4. Umm Yeah's Avatar
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    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfang View Post
    Mmm I don't know man, the Titan II is better specd than the Lumia in every way.
    "Best Phone at CES: Nokia's Lumia 900 With Windows Phone 7" PC World

    "Best phone of CES 2012: Nokia Lumia 900" ZDNet

    "Nokia Lumia 900 wins awards at CES 2012" WPCentral
    Includes:

    • CNet's "Best of CES" smartphone
    • Popular Mechanics editor's choice award for CES
    • Popular Science "Product of the Future"
    • LAPTOP magazine's "Best of CES" finalists


    This is not going to appear to be a low end phone by anyone's imagination. Pricing it low makes it appear to be low end and comparing the Titan II, which I agree is well priced at $199, will kill high end price point for WP devices in the market and hurt the brand. It will make it less of an object to be coveted and more of something you buy because you can't afford that iPhone.

    Again, I'm not saying I want to pay more than I have to for a phone like this but I also want the WP ecosystem to survive. We need to have WP devices at the low, middle, and high ends of the market, with clear differences between each tier.

    The rigid requirements that MS has in place for WP, while good for numerous reasons, also limit much differentiating between models outside of size (at the cost of pixel density and the screen size increases), storage (currently it seems to max out at 16GB unfortunately), and camera. This doesn't allow for much differentiation between the tiers.

    For whatever reason, I compare it to cars again. Back in the 1960's and earlier, GM had clear differentiations between their car lines. You started with Chevys and as your situation improved, you would move up to a Buick or Pontiac or Oldsmobile and possibly someday, a Cadillac. Alfred Sloan, the long time president and CEO of GM, called this building "a car for every purse and purpose."

    In the 1980's, that all changed. There was a scandal when it was revealed that Oldsmobile engines were appearing in Chevys. Over time, the differentiation between the tiers became less and less. Oldsmobile is gone. Pontiac is gone. Even Saturn came and went. While GM is still around, although after a large government bailout, it's not the same company it was.

    While this analogy is far from perfect, I do think MS needs to allow for more differentiation to make a WP device for "every purse and purpose" as well. Hopefully, Apollo will allow that. We'll have to see.
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  5. pezman726's Avatar
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    #30  
    Samsung Focus Flash -> $50 on contract on ATT when released..can easily be had now for $0.99

    My contract with ATT is up on the day AFTER the 900 is supposed to launch. How long do you think it will be before there is a sale of the 900 for $50! That's my price point, and I really want this phone. I'm figuring sometime within the first month or two that it is out there will be a weekend sale, pretty much the same as every other windows phone that has launched has had! :D
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  6. Umm Yeah's Avatar
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    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by pezman726 View Post
    Samsung Focus Flash -> $50 on contract on ATT when released..can easily be had now for $0.99

    My contract with ATT is up on the day AFTER the 900 is supposed to launch. How long do you think it will be before there is a sale of the 900 for $50! That's my price point, and I really want this phone. I'm figuring sometime within the first month or two that it is out there will be a weekend sale, pretty much the same as every other windows phone that has launched has had! :D
    Good for you, bad for WP.
  7. Winterfang's Avatar
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    #32  
    But even the latest well specd Android devices gets insane deals on the first weeks and crazy discounts in a couple of months. I don't think people will see this as more expensive = better. The iphone didn't start selling up until it was priced contemptibly.
  8. Joelist's Avatar
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    #33  
    Couple things:

    1) The Lumia 900 is a high end phone. Build quality has always been a Nokia trademark and their Zeiss cameras have always been the best in the phone camera business. The price is another way to catch eyes and - yes- buy market share. And Windows Phone needs that market share bought so that it has critical mass.

    2) The Hyundai example is off base. Not only are they regularly topping the charts on quality and service but their sales across all their lines are gangbusters.
  9. Drivingrain's Avatar
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    #34  
    It looks like Im the only one who is more concerned about tidbit in the link about the possibility of the launch date sliding beyond March 18th; when will the 3/18 be confirmed?
  10. cckgz4's Avatar
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    #35  
    Thank god for the ffc

    sent from the MyTouch 4G
    Nokia Lumia 1020 owner here...

  11. DanSmithKY's Avatar
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    #36  
    Off topic, but since I read this, I've decided to never buy a Hyundai product:
    Divest Terror website lists companies that are investing in countries that sponsor terror
    Xbox Live Gamertag: DanSmithKY
  12. kenosando's Avatar
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    #37  
    March 18 is my birthday, and I have been eligible for upgrade since December!

    The pricing is interesting because what happens if the 800 is picked up by a carrier? Does that get priced at $99 as well, or $49 with the Lumia 710, or split the difference at $75? 800 will be available in Canada on TELUS, so I guess we'll see what price it gets. Would be crazy if that is the same price as the 900, or higher.
  13. Reflexx's Avatar
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    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Umm Yeah... View Post
    Actually, there are articles now saying that the low price in the 900 will kill demand in the HTC Titan II. See it here -http://thenextweb.com/mobile/2012/01/25/the-htc-titan-ii-is-dead-on-arrival/ I just don't want the WP devices to be pigeonholed as the down market alternative. Why would anyone pay twice as much for a phone that offers little more than a larger screen and a higher mp camera.
    It's a legitimate concern if you're HTC. They're going to need to do some big marketing to position it as a super premium device. Their challenge is that Nokia is going to be doing the same type of marketing with the 900.

    But I don't think this will hurt WP in the long run. I think that even if it drives prices lower, people will still see WP as a premium OS.

    It will be different from Apple. With Apple, you see the device and the OS as one unit. With WP and Android, the OS stands on its own. And you then attempt to buy a particular device that you judge as budget, regular, or premium.

    The disadvantage that Android has is that even though consumers only know it as Android, they can be confused when they look at different handsets and see completely different software experiences. With WP, they'll look at different handsets and decide if they want the big screen, higher megapixel camera, exclusive apps, etc...
  14. Reflexx's Avatar
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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by kenosando View Post
    March 18 is my birthday, and I have been eligible for upgrade since December!

    The pricing is interesting because what happens if the 800 is picked up by a carrier? Does that get priced at $99 as well, or $49 with the Lumia 710, or split the difference at $75? 800 will be available in Canada on TELUS, so I guess we'll see what price it gets. Would be crazy if that is the same price as the 900, or higher.
    I imagine that if the 800 does get picked up, the 710 price will drop to free with contract. Then the 800 will take its place at $49.
  15. theefman's Avatar
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    #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by Umm Yeah... View Post
    Good for you, bad for WP.
    Here's a thought, if Nokia prices the 900 at $99 imagine what they will have planned for a 199 price point. And I think rather than being though of as low end, the quality of the OS and the hardware will make it seem a huge bargain. Positive reactions, good for WP.
    Coolaaron88 and pezman726 like this.
  16. GazooAz's Avatar
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    #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by Winning Guy View Post
    I imagine that if the 800 does get picked up, the 710 price will drop to free with contract. Then the 800 will take its place at $49.
    I would jump on that deal
  17. ChristianKing's Avatar
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    #42  
    I think the concept of budget, Mid Tear and Halo devices does'nt really fit well when it comes to windows phone. Companies do that because it makes people comfortable with paying more or less for a product. Windows Phone from a hardware perspective is more like an iPhone, as in one device, not 50 different iterations. When you look at the Spec sheet Microsoft releases for windows phone, most of the specs fit what we would consider to be a mid tear device. I think Microsoft knows a spec war with Android is a waste of money for Manufactures because the volume sales arent there for high end phones. I think they looked at apple and said thats the model we want but we need to sell it like windows. Camera and Screen Tech are the only real differences between any windows phone device. That means the experience is going to basically be the same across all price points, which is pretty compelling for the cheap and tech elitist alike. Short of the camera, the 710, 800 and 900 are the same device. Yes one uses LCD and the other OLED with some tint applied but short of the shell they're the same device. We tech eletist dont like that thought . It means grandma has a device as good as yours even if she only knows how to text and make calls :mad:. People are worried that the $99 price point will cause people to think that the Lumia 900 isn't a premium device as if the price determines whats top shelf and whats not. It's all really just marketing brainwashing. I've used a Titan, Samsung Focus S and a Lumia 710. Regardless of what all these circus reviews say, the experience was 95% the same. Some had better EQ settings, some had better viewing in the sunlight and some had a better camera, but the day to day experience using the devices were all the same. This is what Microsoft wants. Instead of BMWs and Kias, they wanted to build a Honda Accord. Everyone is basically comfortable with a Honda Accord. Call it what you want, but based on the experience, they've succeded whether you pay $49 or $199 dolloars. Over time manufacturers will discover it's financially effective to sell Honda accords in 10 colors than to sell a Kia, Accord and a BMW in my oppinion. Or to just try and sell a Toyota Camry with a Lexus badge (iPhone). These are just my thoughts, but if you can transition your mind away from the "I'm unique because I have an "S" attached to the end of my phones name mentality," to the I just want to be able to do cool things and interact with my frineds in exiting ways without worrying about who cant recieve this picture without running out of memory or pentile fuzzy logic, you'll feel a strange liberation from the spec wars and view these devices in a very different light. You can get the 900, give the wife the 800 (magenta) and slide the kid the 710 and guess what; You could all trade phones and experience no real difference short of the network speeds. Manufacturers love this. They get the same quality across the board but get to slap shiny expensive/cheap stickers on them to make everyone happy. ;) Now who can tell me why what I've just written is just plain wrong? This I've got hear.
    Last edited by ChristianKing; 01-31-2012 at 11:05 AM.
  18. kenosando's Avatar
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    #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by ChristianKing View Post
    Short of the camera, the 710, 800 and 900 are the same device. Yes one uses LCD and the other OLED with some tint applied but short of the shell they're the same device.
    Lumia comparison of features

    While there are some similarities, such as RAM, and CPU speed, there are quite a few differences. The screen on the 710 actually has a higher color depth than the 800, although the 800 is a higher contrast screen, and perhaps that is due to the pentile matrix subpixel arrangement that the color depth (16) is less than that of the 900 (24).
    Last edited by kenosando; 01-31-2012 at 03:20 PM.
  19. Reflexx's Avatar
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    #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by ChristianKing View Post
    I think the concept of budget, Mid Tear and Halo devices does'nt really fit well when it comes to windows phone. *snip* They get the same quality across the board but get to slap shiny expensive/cheap stickers on them to make everyone happy. ;) Now who can tell me why what I've just written is just plain wrong? This I've got hear.
    Yes. The general OS experience is the same.

    But I think you're putting too little weight to the hardware differences. Let's look at Nokia for example. Compare the 800 and 900.

    LTE
    better camera
    better display tech
    bigger screen size

    Each one of those is something that people are willing to pay extra for. It does differentiate the product.

    I have a Samsung Focus and an HTC Titan. While the general OS experience is the same, I much prefer the Titan. I prefer it by a wide margin. And that's not to say anything negative about the Focus. I just really like the Titan significantly more. The huge screen and better camera do put it in a different class.


    When driving a Honda Accord or a BMW, 90% of the driving experience is the same. But many people would pay extra for the BMW.
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  20. alpinestars1z's Avatar
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    #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by Winning Guy View Post
    When driving a Honda Accord or a BMW, 90% of the driving experience is the same. But many people would pay extra for the BMW.
    Lol is it really? I thought the BMW was supposed to be a driver's car being RWD, having good handling, good steering feel, etc.?

    The other part I think is true though, many people pay for the badge.
  21. Reflexx's Avatar
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    #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by alpinestars1Z View Post
    Lol is it really? I thought the BMW was supposed to be a driver's car being RWD, having good handling, good steering feel, etc.?

    The other part I think is true though, many people pay for the badge.
    When you're driving 40 mph on side roads and 65 mph in mostly a straight line on freeways, there isn't much difference.

    Honda suspensions tend to be pretty tight. Same with BMW. And in normal driving, there isn't that much difference to your experience. Will you feel a little difference because of the FWD compared to RWD? Yeah. But not that much. The "experience" is still pretty much the same. You're driving to your destination.

    But would I rather have the BMW? **** yes. Just for that 10%.
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  22. ChristianKing's Avatar
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    #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by Winning Guy View Post
    When you're driving 40 mph on side roads and 65 mph in mostly a straight line on freeways, there isn't much difference.

    Honda suspensions tend to be pretty tight. Same with BMW. And in normal driving, there isn't that much difference to your experience. Will you feel a little difference because of the FWD compared to RWD? Yeah. But not that much. The "experience" is still pretty much the same. You're driving to your destination.

    But would I rather have the BMW? **** yes. Just for that 10%.
    Badges, we don't need no stinking badges :lol:

    The only problem with this comparison is that from a tech perspective, WP isn't today what even Nokia would describe as a BMW. They've clearly stated that Apollo is when you'll see some drool worth tech. For sales there are variances that seperate the Lumia line, but if we really put aside the inate desire to feel like we have something uniquely special in the 900, is there really enough of a difference between the 710 and 900 to charge $199 like most of us expected. I think nokia selected the $99 price tag to move volume, however, i also think they chose the $99 price point because in their road map, the 900 really is a mid tear phone that isn't really worthy of the HALO device status. Its the phone thats supposed to be everywhere, but not the phone at the top of their Engineering bin. Even the Design chief mentioned that the Lumia Line at the end of 2012 will feature a higher spec screen, NFC, wireless charging and perhaps, no ports at all if he had his way(this wont happen any time soon).

    I think the 900 is perfect at $99 and considered an accord. From a mindshare stadpoint the fact that it's pretty is the best approach nokia could take. the 900 to me is like the XBox 360. Tech wise, it's sufficient, but not great. However, it's got everything you need to build an ecosystem arround it. It's pretty, it's got a cool factor and it's cheep.
  23. wilco9's Avatar
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    #48  
    i'm eligible for upgrade on April 25th, but I really want lumia 900 and I heard people say that ATT would allow you to upgrade a little earlier, is that true? anybody knows about this? I want to grab one Lumia 900 right after it's released, which apparently is gonna be March 18th.
  24. Winterfang's Avatar
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    #49  
    Welcome to WPcentral Wilco9. I guess a month won't kill them, there's a good chance they will negotiate that.

    If I was you I'll wait, since you will now what kind of bugs the phone has and maybe even get a better price :D.
  25. wilco9's Avatar
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    #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfang View Post
    Welcome to WPcentral Wilco9. I guess a month won't kill them, there's a good chance they will negotiate that.

    If I was you I'll wait, since you will now what kind of bugs the phone has and maybe even get a better price :D.
    thanks! i'm just afraid it'll be sold out pretty soon after release, like some people have suggested.
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