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  1. maverick786us's Avatar
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       #1  
    Has microsoft made an oath to stay behind other devices? Their support for multi-core and 720P came late in the form of Lumia 920 almost an year after android launched their first dual core device with HD resolution.

    If EOS has quad core, which is a welcome move. But why WP doesn't have support for 1080P? 1080P is the new standard for high end android smartphones and I've read
    somewhere that Microsoft doesn't have any plan to support 1080P.
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  2. broar94's Avatar
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    #2  
    First let them develop quality apps and compete against Android/IOS. Right now, the Marketshare is only 3% of the worldwide shipments?
  3. crash1989's Avatar
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    #3  
    I read it does :D , GDR3 update in the fall should bring quad core, higher res support. Why do you need a quad core or octa core device, is WP lagging - no, is it stable - yes etc ..

    Coz if it were like Android,although I like it a lot, you sometimes have lag at nonsensical places and fragmentation of devices (esp in emerging markets). The reason why Windows Phone is able to perform so well on a 130$ Lumia 520 and 600$ Lumia 925 i s that Microsoft has a firm grip on its OEMs and development of windows phone.

    It is very similar to apple + OEM model. Please do reply where you read the standards for displays,I am sure there is no set standard. It is just a trend in HIgher androids.
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  4. maverick786us's Avatar
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       #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by crash1989 View Post
    I read it does :D , GDR3 update in the fall should bring quad core, higher res support. Why do you need a quad core or octa core device, is WP lagging - no, is it stable - yes etc ..

    Coz if it were like Android,although I like it a lot, you sometimes have lag at nonsensical places and fragmentation of devices (esp in emerging markets). The reason why Windows Phone is able to perform so well on a 130$ Lumia 520 and 600$ Lumia 925 i s that Microsoft has a firm grip on its OEMs and development of windows phone.

    It is very similar to apple + OEM model. Please do reply where you read the standards for displays,I am sure there is no set standard. It is just a trend in HIgher androids.
    I didn't actually mean standard. 2013 belongs to 1080P mobile devices. If you look at all the high end Android Devices of 2013 LG Optimus G Pro, Galaxy S4, Xperia Z, all have 1080P resolution. The future devices will all shift its focus to 1080P. So Lumia EOS being this years highly anticipated flagship device should have implemented 1080P resolution. If MS and Nokia would have bring 1080P resolution to its flagship devices next by year, Anrdoid will jump to 1440P, thus staying ahead in the competition.

    Quad core is needed for higher image processing and gaming. Take an example: Galaxy S3 can stores all its burst shot pics at 8MP resolution because of faster quad core CPU. But with Lumia 920, the smart shot pics are reduced to 5MP format due to processor limitation. At best using blink all the imges are stored at 4-5 MP resolution. Because this 1.5Ghz dual core processor is not capable for storing burst shot images at such a high resolution.
    Last edited by maverick786us; 06-27-2013 at 07:06 AM.
    (Gaming Rig)
    CPU............................Intel E8400 @ 3.6Ghz
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    PSU..............................Corsair 650TX 650W
    Case..............................................CM 690
    Display...................Dell SP2208WFP (22 inch)
    O.S.........................Windows 7 Ultimatum 64
    tissotti and Mohak Adav like this.
  5. z33dev33l's Avatar
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    #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by maverick786us View Post
    I didn't actually mean standard. 2013 belongs to 1080P mobile devices. If you look at all the high end Android Devices LG Optimus G Pro, Galaxy S4, Xperia Z, all have 1080P resolution. The future devices will all shift to 1080P. So Lumia EOS being this years highly anticipated flagship device would have implemented 1080P resolution. If MS and Nokia bring 1080P resolution to its flagship devices next by year, Anrdoid will jump to 1440P thus staying ahead in the competition.

    The reason we need quad core is for higher image processing and gaming. Take an example: Galaxy S3 can store burst shot pics all at 8MP resolution because of faster quad core CPU. But Lumia 920 stores nokia smart shot pics in 5MP format. At best using blink all the imges are stored at 4-5 MP resolution. Because this 1.5Ghz dual core processor is not capable for storing burst shot images at such a high resolution.
    When the 8x and 920 came out they had the highest pixel densities commercially available in their aspect ratio and my dual core 920 will still run circles around the "octa-core" s4.
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  6. z33dev33l's Avatar
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    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by maverick786us View Post
    I didn't actually mean standard. 2013 belongs to 1080P mobile devices. If you look at all the high end Android Devices LG Optimus G Pro, Galaxy S4, Xperia Z, all have 1080P resolution. The future devices will all shift to 1080P. So Lumia EOS being this years highly anticipated flagship device would have implemented 1080P resolution. If MS and Nokia bring 1080P resolution to its flagship devices next by year, Anrdoid will jump to 1440P thus staying ahead in the competition.

    The reason we need quad core is for higher image processing and gaming. Take an example: Galaxy S3 can store burst shot pics all at 8MP resolution because of faster quad core CPU. But Lumia 920 stores nokia smart shot pics in 5MP format. At best using blink all the imges are stored at 4-5 MP resolution. Because this 1.5Ghz dual core processor is not capable for storing burst shot images at such a high resolution.
    The human eye literally cannot detect nor differentiate between 720p and 1080p on a sub 12 inch device. It's absolutely unintelligible to make that argument and the only reason android pushes it is because android is a specs war. Don't turn a mobile OS that actually works into a spec war.
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  7. In Limbo's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    The human eye literally cannot detect nor differentiate between 720p and 1080p on a sub 12 inch device. It's absolutely unintelligible to make that argument and the only reason android pushes it is because android is a specs war. Don't turn a mobile OS that actually works into a spec war.
    Dude thank you for saving me breath. There are so many things about that comment that I was about to waste time replying to.

    You make an excellent point about the "spec war" aspect of Android. They do make some genuinely awesome phones, but they've also obscured the true practicality of some mobile phone technologies (1080p, megapixels, etc. (lol)). Then the uninformed consumer walks around shouting about how we need an 8-core, 2160p, 16gb RAM, 41megapixel phone (Credit to Nokia for over-sampling!).

    Microsoft knows what they're doing guys. You may not agree with their immediate direction; Even I don't occasionally. But hey, they got us this far, and they still have more up their sleeve.
    xconomicron likes this.
  8. nessinhaw's Avatar
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    #8  
    oh boy what android spec wars did to people lol

    and i believe EOS is a camera phone? not sure it will replace 920 as flagship, it's too niche!
  9. Mike Gibson's Avatar
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    #9  
    The 920 display has 1280x768 pixels and a 4.5" diagonal, which results in a resolution of 332 ppi (which is *really* high). If you increase the display to 1800x1080 pixels, the diagonal length would need to increase to 6.36" to maintain the same ppi.

    The sub-920 families have around 230 ppi values, which is a little low these days.
  10. crash1989's Avatar
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    #10  
    I think we agree that Android can have all the specs they want. each OS is set to work well with proper specs.

    Android needs 2GB ram, octa core processors or higher specs to run well, so be it.

    Windows Phone and iOS run way better with minimal lag on dual cores with lower ram. It is simple to see why iOS marketplace is such a success due to standardized specs. You see most apps coming to iOS first coz there are far fewer things to worry about than Android. Windows Phone has taken the right step in Microsoft controlling the software for the most part and hardware specs leaving OEMs to innovate on other fronts like Cameras.

    Although there will be spec hungry people like you (not a bad thing) to which Microsoft should ideally cater in Late 2013 as news suggests. Every OS updates once or at most twice every year, it is the same with WP. They should be able to fix most gripes this time hopefully. (BE optimistic)
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  11. NaNoo123's Avatar
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    #11  
    Spec hungry people?
    Regarding processer he gave some very good reasons for wanting better spec.
    Its all well and good saying the OS doesn't lag and doesn't need it, but OS is only part of ecosystem.
    I'm sure your well aware of some games that lag a lot, and most of the time we get old games as it is.
    People dont always want or need the highest spec phone, just look at lumia models sales, so nothing wrong with wanting higher specs either.
  12. EchoRedux's Avatar
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    #12  
    We will see 4K on android phones by the time WP8 gets a 1080p device.
  13. EchoRedux's Avatar
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    When the 8x and 920 came out they had the highest pixel densities commercially available in their aspect ratio and my dual core 920 will still run circles around the "octa-core" s4.
    Higher pixel density is a marketing term for smaller screen
  14. SnatchedIT's Avatar
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    #14  
    I like to use my PC for gaming, thanks. Also, all these burst shot and ****: in the end everyone in the world comes up using them just to show it "for da lulz". You probably come to actually need one of the most advanced features (both in WP and Android flagships) like when, a day in a year?

    Smart phones for silly people. In the end it's what this is all about.
  15. crash1989's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by NaNoo123 View Post
    Spec hungry people?
    Regarding processer he gave some very good reasons for wanting better spec.
    Its all well and good saying the OS doesn't lag and doesn't need it, but OS is only part of ecosystem.
    I'm sure your well aware of some games that lag a lot, and most of the time we get old games as it is.
    People dont always want or need the highest spec phone, just look at lumia models sales, so nothing wrong with wanting higher specs either.
    I put it in brackets it is not a bad thing to want better specs or being spec hungry :D .. I get it, there is nothing wrong with that, just saying that Microsoft might cater to it in GDR3.
    It is not due to the processor that we are getting old games, again my example would be the dual core iPhone 5 . Dual core is pretty powerful, we used to run these in desktops a few years back and they could run pretty decent games :)
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  16. NaNoo123's Avatar
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    #16  
    I never said it was due to processor why we get old games, i said there not the newest and still lag. (i would need to compare iphone 5, cpu and gpu to see if they are equivalent)
    I saw what you put in brackets, but i also read everything else you wrote about how its not needed etc.
    As for other comments made by others that they play games on consoles, burst modes usefulness, i don't understand your point? Or do you believe your speaking for everyone? If you do believe that, you would be very surprised how many like to play games on their mobiles.

    My point is, given the examples he gave with games, burst mode, he has a legitimate reason for wanting higher spec, and not just spec for specs sake. Although i also don't see anything wrong with that, and it should be priced as such.
  17. tissotti's Avatar
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    #17  
    I saw this on Symbian side and its kind of sad to witness this again on WP.

    Nobody is getting hurt by a quad core, it wont slow down your phone, it will give longetivity for software and improve speed of heavy apps (like Nokia's smart camera), opens doors for better games and new hardware options (like 41MP camera, HDMI out, higher resol screen, more freqs supported on a one vers of the phone etc etc.). On battery life these new gen SoC's have improved a lot from the times of GS and iPhone 4 with their single core 1GHz 45nm cores, compared to todays 26nm and smaller.


    If you can get Lumia 920 with Qualcomm 600 or older dual core with same battery life, what would you take? Fact is many do chooce their devices looking at specs (Chinese especially love those spec lists and they are by far largest smartphone market). If you anyways pay 600 euros for your phone and another has a better specs, why not get that one? It's the manufacturer cutting its profits and benefits you.

    I do agree that WP doesn't need or should go as aggressively after the newest and best with Android, neither should they have broad suppprt for many SoC's as their strenght (like on iOS) comes from optimization. Just to keep up with them in a tile manner should be enough. Not being clearly one generation behind.
    maverick786us likes this.
  18. crash1989's Avatar
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    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by NaNoo123 View Post
    I never said it was due to processor why we get old games, i said there not the newest and still lag. (i would need to compare iphone 5, cpu and gpu to see if they are equivalent)
    I saw what you put in brackets, but i also read everything else you wrote about how its not needed etc.
    As for other comments made by others that they play games on consoles, burst modes usefulness, i don't understand your point? Or do you believe your speaking for everyone? If you do believe that, you would be very surprised how many like to play games on their mobiles.

    My point is, given the examples he gave with games, burst mode, he has a legitimate reason for wanting higher spec, and not just spec for specs sake. Although i also don't see anything wrong with that, and it should be priced as such.
    Yup, he has . I agree again , the end.
  19. EchoRedux's Avatar
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    #19  
    I'm curious if the processor is the bottleneck. Seeing phones lag with quad-core while my Focus S runs smoothly makes me thing if the lag is because of the storage or GPU or RAM.
  20. z33dev33l's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by EchoRedux View Post
    I'm curious if the processor is the bottleneck. Seeing phones lag with quad-core while my Focus S runs smoothly makes me thing if the lag is because of the storage or GPU or RAM.
    More ill optimization than anything else.
  21. squire777's Avatar
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    #21  
    Quad core and higher - sure why not. It's not needed at the moment but it wouldn't hurt.

    1080P or higher on a handheld device? Pointless since it won't make a noticeable difference on a screen so small.
  22. NaNoo123's Avatar
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by EchoRedux View Post
    I'm curious if the processor is the bottleneck. Seeing phones lag with quad-core while my Focus S runs smoothly makes me thing if the lag is because of the storage or GPU or RAM.
    that's one of the reasons i mentioned gpu.
    Not all dual or quad cores are equal, gpus must play a part in it all.
    Is the gpu in iphone 5 pretty good, average or what?
    I dont follow what's in iphone, and only have a passing interest in android at the moment. Although that may all change end of year if i continue to feel like MS is treating it like its lowest priority item. Totally personal feeling.
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  23. z33dev33l's Avatar
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    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by NaNoo123 View Post
    that's one of the reasons i mentioned gpu.
    Not all dual or quad cores are equal, gpus must play a part in it all.
    Is the gpu in iphone 5 pretty good, average or what?
    I dont follow what's in iphone, and only have a passing interest in android at the moment. Although that may all change end of year if i continue to feel like MS is treating it like its lowest priority item. Totally personal feeling.
    Gpu is pretty much the only aspect iPhones excel in
  24. Squachy's Avatar
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    #24  
    They'll catch up this upcoming gen. They fubared the entire thing right from the get go. they would have been fine if they started with the Snapdragon S2 instead of the S1.

    When WP7 came out, they were using snapdragon S1/Adreno200 (everyone else was on snapdragon S2/Adreno205)
    When WP7.5 came out they were using snapdragon S2/Adreno205 (everyone was on snapdragon s3/Adreno220, Snapdragon S4/Adreno225)
    When WP8 came out they were using dual core snapdragon S4/Adreno225 (everyone else was moving onto quad core S4 with Adreno225 or 320, and releasing the dual core S4 on mid tier phones and lower)
    When their quad core support comes in they'll be using the Snapdragon 400 (I think this is quad core 1.2-4ghz/Adreno305), 600(1.7-1.9ghz/Adreno320), 800 (2+ghz/Adreno330) line. It'll be current as long as the support gets here (hopefully sooner rather than later).
    Samsung Galaxy S4 uses either its own Exynos 'octa' or Snapdragon 600 (I think). HTC One uses the Snapdragon 600. LG G2 (unannounced currently) will use Snapdragon 800, that sony 6.4" phablet will have Snapdragon 800, the Korean Galaxy S4 is using the Snapdragon 800. So far those are the only devices that have gone Snapdragon 800. Hopefully the Lumia EOS will as well.

    If the Eos comes out with Dual core Snapdragon S4 with Adreno225 again (same guts as the Lumia 920).....that will be an epic fail and will be a pretty sad flagship especially if its going to be compared with the HTC One and Galaxy S4. The loudest voice always comes from the vocal minority, which is almost always the tech enthusiast group. That usually leads the perception. mid-tier phones and low end phones may sell the most but they usually go about it quietly.

    If they make it clear they have 2 variants then perhaps depending on when the second variant is coming they can get away with it.

    Apple processors and GPU are especially good which is why they can get away with yearly interval upgrades. They've always performed near or at the top of every new Android release.
    maverick786us likes this.
  25. smoledman's Avatar
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    #25  
    Microsoft was late to start on Windows Phone with NT kernel compared to iOS & Android development lines. 2-3 years late. I don't think Microsoft can ever catch up as Apple/Google are proceeding at breakneck speed.
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