12-30-2012, 05:50 PM #26
- 842 Posts
I'm not sure who is saying never use Google products. I for one use Google search all the time on PC (Bing on phone). I also use Chrome Browser on PC and of course YouTube.
Its products like their Gmail, Google Docs, Google+ and the worst, Android that I've completely avoided now.
Outlook.com is SOOOOO much better than Gmail.
Google is a search company. Using them for search is perfectly logical. That's what they are best at.
12-30-2012, 06:25 PM #27
- 184 Posts
Google boycott is just silly, they have great products. Some have Microsoft equivalent, some don't. I use whichever software is better, I'm the one missing out otherwise. I can live with Outlook, Skydrive, Bing maps and Office365 but to me Search, Chrome, Google Reader, Google Earth and Youtube are just irreplaceable or just better than similar Microsoft products. That doesn't mean I would enjoy Android better, I absolutely love Windows Phone even though it's far from perfect.
- 12-30-2012, 06:44 PM #29
Have you ever "gmailed" your mother about an illness... Google knows about it. Have you ever "gmailed" a friend about marriage problems... Google knows about it. Have you ever searched for the morning-after-pill on the internet while logged in... Google knows about it. People might find this far fetched, but it's really barely the basics. I've worked on these kinds of systems and they can literally deduce information about you that not even you yourself know. Google collects incredible amounts of data on each of their users. The creepy thing is, that you have no idea who has access to it.
If you are fine with that, great, no problem. That is your choice to make. Although I have nothing to hide, I still don't want people jumping to conclusions about me, based solely on Google's profiling algorithms.
Chrome too is primarily a means of collecting data. Surely they aren't giving it to you for free, out of the goodness of their hearts. The tricky thing about Chrome is that it has access to your entire computer and every file on it. I view Chrome as spyware and would never install it on any system I use, ever.
I do agree that we can go overboard though... at some point protecting your privacy boarders on paranoia.
12-30-2012, 06:57 PM #30
- 184 Posts
I understand... and don't care. Let them collect whatever they want, I don't have much to hide. Outside the US, Bing search is nowhere as good as Google so using Bing (or whatever else) just on principle is silly. I'm not a primary Gmail user so I'm pretty much never logged on when I browse the net, I think I only log on to check my youtube subscriptions. Really I'm fine using whatever Google has to offer unless someone else does it before.
- 12-30-2012, 07:42 PM #32
I am forced to use google as I have alot of people on YouTube who want to see me post videos ON YOUTUBE. :( other than YouTube, I am now FULL BING! :D
12-30-2012, 07:49 PM #34
- 283 Posts
I'm weening off. I already use Bing 100% as my search engine. I started my Outlook.com addresses to replace Gmail as email. Next up is to move my private domain, which I'm a little worried about doing it right.
I will only be on YouTube within the month.
- 12-30-2012, 08:01 PM #36
- 12-30-2012, 08:06 PM #37
12-30-2012, 08:21 PM #38
- 26 Posts
As someone who hopes to go into the localization business myself in the near future, I'm sorry to hear that bing has not yet been well implemented in Switzerland. I can't blame you for using Google search in that case, but there is a google search app for WP, and the google site works fine in the browser yes? That being said, you should be able to use google search to your heart's content. I don't understand why it would be a big issue. Even syncing Gmail isn't an issue. It's calendar, drive, voice and other services that will NOT work since they are proprietary software.
As for other device services, it's too bad that local scout and other features don't function well there either. I don't know what impression you have about iPhone there, but iPhone users in the UK and France were extremely angry about issues with Siri (not sure if they were ever resolved) since saying "I'm hungry" (or <<j'ai faim>>) wouldn't return anything simply because there were almost no restaurants listed in an online database. Also, simple changes in accent were unrecognizable. I think that Local Scout is in a similar situation now. And it SHOULD work, but I honestly don't believe the problem is from lack of trying localization is an extremely difficult feat because it requires software engineers who are also proficient in multiple languages and oftentimes there are none of these in a particular language OR they don't want to work for Microsoft. Let's only hope that this will change with the continued sales of WP8
As for me, I think I'll apply to be a French localization specialist in Switzerland after I get my masters
- 12-30-2012, 08:32 PM #39
@rtoheich: Good luck and best wishes!! I WISH I could Master something... anything....
I find this thread kind of fun. Outside of YouTube, MS tries to offer something to compete with both Google and Apple. They have really nailed Bing were it is working. I have gotten to the point I use it and prefer it, and that was truly before I started becoming a WP user. But I do live in the US, and I think we have concluded that MS is a long way from Bing being a worldwide option.
Otherwise, I am enjoying my developing ecosystem. I think it is okay to work within what is best for you. Not that everyone agrees or would even be open minded to you doing it, even if did not hurt them. Roll over to Android Central and start this thread there. There would be much rage and nashing of teeth as the Troll Hunters would grab their pitchforks and light their torches...."Life is hard. But it is harder when you are stupid."
- 12-30-2012, 08:51 PM #41
I haven't used google regularly for probably since 2009 or whenever bing first rolled out. I still use it occasionally. Bing thou works 99% of the time. And the 1% of the time i can not find what I need on Bing, usually Google can't find it either. They equal search providers. I just choose to use Bing instead.
As for other services. Google Calendar is much better than anything other than outlook (the application). The Live Calendar is horrible. So I use Gmail because my university is a Google Apps user, and then I the same calendar for personal and education. I don't think I will ever loose google 100%, but if google disappeared I would be just fine.
I wish my school subscribed to office 365, we use this at work and it is freaken awesome compared to google apps. I would use my work calendar for personal but I do not want my bosses looking at my personal calendar. ;P
- 12-30-2012, 09:01 PM #42
I feel that Microsoft just doesn't understand anything about the world outside the U.S. For example, I really don't understand why the website www.bing.ch exists in the first place. Why not just stick with www.bing.com, and make everything else configurable?
For example, although I live in Switzerland, I am interested in news from Germany, the U.S., China, anything related to the EU and Switzerland. I prefer most of my web searches to be in English, but I want to quickly switch to French or German searches when necessary. I'm rarely interested in restricting my searches only to sites in Switzerland. Unfortunately, Microsoft insists on pigeonholing everyone, based on what country they currently live in. That might work in the U.S. where most people speak exactly one language and aren't much interested in the happenings beyond their boarders, but that is completely different for Europeans. We cross boarders constantly and we typically speak more than one language, and that affects what we are interested in and how we use search.
Like I said, all this stuff should be configurable, and not based on the country code of the domain you use to search.
- 12-30-2012, 09:13 PM #44
I live in the U.S. and I think Bing is merely adequate. I tried sticking to Bing only when i first got my Lumia 900 ( i used Bing exclusively on my computer too) and i made it about a month. I even took the "Bing it on challenge" and Google won by a landslide. I really wanted to like Bing, especially since I am stuck with a permanent Bing button on my phone.
But the truth is, its just not as good as Google. I still use it because the button is there, but I've never once seen it give me better/more relevant search results than Google. It is adequate for most things though.
As for the rest of this, I don't see the point in inconveniencing myself greatly just to try and be Google free. Yes, Google is an advertising company that will info-mine your internet surfing habits, but if you think Bing doesn't do the same thing, you're deluding yourself. Every company with a presence on the web does it in one form or another. Unless you're going to delete your Facebook account and every other identifying piece of info on the web and surf the internet using Tor from now on, there is no sense in working yourself up into a lather over this stuff and thinking you are some kind of internet privacy warrior because you use Bing and hotmail.
12-30-2012, 09:20 PM #45
- 842 Posts
And yes, I know all about their tracking of search etc. I use those services at the company I work for. And the reason those services are so effective for businesses is because Google's consumer products are so good at what they do that a majority of consumers use their products instead of the other.
- 12-30-2012, 09:26 PM #46
In regard to Local Scout, well, the button to launch Local Scout simply doesn't exist in WP. You can't even start it. You are likely correct that this is due to a lack of data (although Microsoft does have more than nothing). Interestingly, Nokia has more than enough data for all of Europe, but they apparently haven't merged their POI databases. I was under the impression that Microsoft and Nokia were going to merge ALL their mapping data, but as of yet it hasn't happened. Anyway, none of this requires bilingual engineers. Most junior developers could get this job done.
Last edited by a5cent; 12-30-2012 at 10:32 PM. Reason: Spelling
- 12-30-2012, 09:29 PM #47
If you've used Google for a long time you can't just leave it all of a sudden. Bing and Hotmail/Outlook are both mediocre services. Everyone uses Google and Gmail because quite simply they are superior services. Google Maps are awesome. This is me not being a fanboy, this is me stating a fact(I'm not even an Android user). Go check out some stats on how many people use Google and how many people use Bing. Google is the BEST search engine out there BY FAR.
As someone said above, Microsoft does not understand the world outside the US which is why Windows Phone has been such a miserable failure in Europe and Asia. Wanna see how Good Microsoft is outside the US? Go check out the Bing maps of Japan. People on this forum talk about simply 'switching' to outlook are people who've probably not used email/calendar/maps etc from other providers. Because if they did then they'd know you can't just 'switch' over from something you'd been using for 10+ years.
- 12-30-2012, 09:37 PM #48
Another thing we've found at work is that when Microsoft releases something new, like a beta product, Google will find where it can be downloaded but not Bing. Explain that one! When Windows 8 RC was released, we used Google to find the download site. It showed up in a Bing search after a few days, and the resulting hits were identical to Google's.
I'm probably in the minority here when I say that I couldn't care less what Google or anyone else collects about me. If they want to waste their server storage on my data, more power to them! The thing is, that data is what helps make Google's search results better than the competition. Bing and most other major search engines collect data too; they just aren't as good at using it as Google.
- 12-30-2012, 10:27 PM #50
It's something that must be evaluated on a case by case basis.
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